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Thread: This irks the shit out of me

  1. #1
    God/dess Vyanka's Avatar
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    Default This irks the shit out of me

    A rant here. People who assume that if a girl gets a BA, she has nothing going for herself, has very low self esteem, no intelligence or a personality.

    I mean it's one thing that you're not attracted to someone who has had PS, that's fine but to make those assumptions annoy me....aaggh!

    And while we're on the topic, what do you girls think about this?

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20185882/

    Breast implants linked to increased suicide risk

    Chance of taking own life is three times higher after surgery, experts say


    WASHINGTON - Women who get cosmetic breast implants are nearly three times as likely to commit suicide as other women, U.S. researchers reported on Wednesday.


    Now some idiots assume everyone with BA is suicidal too.
    Last edited by Vyanka; 08-09-2007 at 11:26 AM.

  2. #2
    God/dess Susan-Va's Avatar
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    Suicide? WTF?

    I've so fuckin' happy with mine it's stoopid!

  3. #3
    Member Dr Wulf's Avatar
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    I do think that MSNBC was a bit reckless and irresponsible for reporting this study the way it did. As Vyanka said, it's quite easy to draw the wrong conclusions from the title. Of almost 4000 women, around 20 took their own lives over the span of 20 years. So roughly, 3 times an already very small number is still a small number.

    What the article fails to mention, because the study had no way to know, is the motives of these women. Why did the suicidal women want implants? Did they undergo proper screening? We see women come in for augmentation with all kinds of reasons - reconstruction, restoration, career building, revenge, self-esteem, etc.

    There are legitimate reasons for plastic surgery, and illegitimate ones. So what we do as responsible surgeons, is to try to filter out the people who are doing this to fill a psychological void in their lives or who have dysmorphic disorders. What I suspect is that many women who should not have been elligible for surgery slipped through the cracks and wanted implants for the wrong receives.

    I believe they did not kill themselves because of the implants, but rather, because they didn't address their psychological needs in a contructive way. It's unfortunate that the title wasn't something less stigmatizing, because now everyone gets painted with the same brush, including the doctors.
    There is no great genius without a mixture of madness.

  4. #4
    cameron_keys
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    Quote Originally Posted by Susan-Va View Post
    Suicide? WTF?

    I've so fuckin' happy with mine it's stoopid!
    Seriously!! ALl I do now is stare at them and play with them!! And I've had them almost 2 years, so it isnt even like they are new..I just love em!


    But yes, some people use PS instead of therapy ...and then get more depressed when thye realize that fixing the outside doesnt fix the inside. THOSE are the suicide risks. Has nothing to do with actual PS.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    opps I guess I should have visited the lounge first today because I just posted this same news story in body biz.

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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Wulf View Post

    I believe they did not kill themselves because of the implants, but rather, because they didn't address their psychological needs in a constructive way. It's unfortunate that the title wasn't something less stigmatizing, because now everyone gets painted with the same brush, including the doctors.
    Exactly. What a dumb way to report this so called study. Certainly can't believe everything that you read.
    you live like an ivy vine
    you can only survive by clinging onto trees
    that's your flaw
    put down some roots so you can stand on your own
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  7. #7
    Featured Member southstbabe's Avatar
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    I'm still trying to figure out who sat down and thought to themselves...

    I wonder if there is any link to breast implants and suicide?

    I'm guessing someone with waaaay to much time on their hands.

  8. #8
    cameron_keys
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    The stupid thing is you could compare ANY two things and say this.

    Like...is the suicide rate higher for people who eat Nacho Doritos or Cool Ranch Doritos?
    They wont be exactly even....so whichever is higher...you can then say that studies show that eating Nacho Doritos raises the likelyhood of suicide.

    Ridiculous.

  9. #9
    God/dess xdamage's Avatar
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    Even when relationships are established by good studies, the interpretation of cause and effect is not always clear. For example, in this case a reasonable interpretation is that the tendency to commit suicide is a pre-existing psychological tendency, and that these people are more likely to try plastic surgery (or other things) in an attempt to change how they feel about themselves. The inverse would be that people that are less likely to commit suicide are also less likely to use surgery to change their bodies. I'm not saying that is fact, I'm just saying that's one interpretation where the cause and effect order are reversed.

  10. #10
    Veteran Member Lapaholic's Avatar
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    Quote Originally Posted by cameron_keys View Post
    T

    Like...is the suicide rate higher for people who eat Nacho Doritos or Cool Ranch Doritos?

    Ridiculous.
    Yikes!!!

    Yeah correlations can be superficial - thats why I always take these statistically based news reports with a very large grain of salt. WE need the author of Freakanomics to check this out.

  11. #11
    God/dess xdamage's Avatar
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    Quote Originally Posted by Lapaholic View Post
    thats why I always take these statistically based news reports with a very large grain of salt.
    Most news is fundamentally entertainment driven, so there is a conflict of interest between reporting accurately, and reporting what is most likely to increase viewer or readership. And statistics can be misleading, even dangerous things out of context. Still, for example, that doesn't mean there is never anything of truth buried in amongst the muck. For example, there was a thread on here about house birds dying if exposed to heated teflon pans. That wasn't always known, and if your bird died for mysterious reasons it probably never occurred to most people it could have been prevented. Early on the correlation was fuzzy, but ultimately worth exploring as we see now Dupont acknowledges (if you search their website) that there is a correlation (although they carefully word it).

    There is nothing really fundamentally wrong with studying correlations since sometimes they lead to unexpected facts that were previously unknown. Say for example that eventually we learn that the presence of breast implants actually can trigger chemical changes in some people's bodies which increases ones chances of being depressed or suicidal. We'd be better off knowing that rather then not knowing it. And who knows, in time we might even be able to associate that kind of thing with specific genes that can be tested for. Most medical procedures and medicines do have associated risks, and I don't see how it harms us as a society or individuals to have more knowledge about the risks. And I'm not in favor of only publishing the positive sides of medicine or surgery to the public either - a balance is overall a good thing.

    The only real problem I do see is that news services frequently publish statistics and opinions to increase readership/viewership, not because they have any vested interest in seeking out facts.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    Quote Originally Posted by xdamage View Post
    Even when relationships are established by good studies, the interpretation of cause and effect is not always clear. For example, in this case a reasonable interpretation is that the tendency to commit suicide is a pre-existing psychological tendency, and that these people are more likely to try plastic surgery (or other things) in an attempt to change how they feel about themselves. The inverse would be that people that are less likely to commit suicide are also less likely to use surgery to change their bodies. I'm not saying that is fact, I'm just saying that's one interpretation where the cause and effect order are reversed.
    I think X's point can be more clearly stated by saying that both BA ( until today I thought that meant Bachelor of Arts ) and suicide attempts are done by people who are unhappy about some aspect of their life, probably caused by some questions about self-worth. They are not related to each other except for the fact that they "appeal" to people with similar esteem issues.
    "never trust a big butt and a smile"-- Bell Biv DeVoe

    If you're in your twenties and aren't a liberal, you have no heart. If you're in you're forties and aren't a conservative, you have no brain - Winston Churchill

  13. #13
    God/dess ExoticEngineer's Avatar
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    Ugh! I jsut talked about this with a customer last night. he said to me "Well obviously you had low self esteem, or body image issues to make you want a boob job, so you were unhappy, and unhappiness can lead to depression which leads to suicide."

    Total Loss For Words...

    He says "seriously, to dislike your body so much that you do something so drastic to it is a major warning sign!"

    Holy crap that pisses me off! And again yesterday I ws talking to this girl I sort of knew, and her friend who I did not know at all... friend says "Did you get implants?" Staring at my chest. "yes"
    She says "I think it's so fcked up that women feel like they have to alter their bodies and do dangerous things to them to make them beautiful, that's sort of fcked in the head if you think about it."

    ACK!!!!!

    Okay zealots, go back home!




  14. #14
    God/dess Vyanka's Avatar
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    Quote Originally Posted by ExoticEngineer View Post
    Ugh! I jsut talked about this with a customer last night. he said to me "Well obviously you had low self esteem, or body image issues to make you want a boob job, so you were unhappy, and unhappiness can lead to depression which leads to suicide."

    Total Loss For Words...

    He says "seriously, to dislike your body so much that you do something so drastic to it is a major warning sign!"

    Holy crap that pisses me off! And again yesterday I ws talking to this girl I sort of knew, and her friend who I did not know at all... friend says "Did you get implants?" Staring at my chest. "yes"
    She says "I think it's so fcked up that women feel like they have to alter their bodies and do dangerous things to them to make them beautiful, that's sort of fcked in the head if you think about it."

    ACK!!!!!

    Okay zealots, go back home!
    Oh jees. Yeah, and they sound like rude assholes. Yet we're fucked in the head with tons of issues.

  15. #15
    God/dess ExoticEngineer's Avatar
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    I told the guy with all the caffine, sugar, salt, sunlight, water from the faucet and microwaved food I have ingested, I should be kicking the bucket any minute now. Good thing I got that boob job I'd always wanted first!




  16. #16
    Moderator Optimist's Avatar
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    Clubs are filled with insecure guys who have to cut us down. They can't feel comfortable in our presence until they cut us down to their size. It's becoming more common as men take a financial beating in the outside world but don't want to give up their fantasy trips to see us.
    “What a caterpillar calls the end of the world we call a butterfly.” - ECKHART TOLLE

  17. #17
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    I did read the study and they did make it seem like ZOMG BOOB JOB = SUICIDEZ. Some people who go the plastic surgery route have problems with their body that they do not address properly with therapy and counseling. They prefer the quick-fix and denial of plastic surgery. However, the original problem still exists. Silicone and Saline are not depression cures, as some women may believe they are. A perfect body does not mean a clear mind.

  18. #18
    God/dess Casual Observer's Avatar
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    "I think it's so fcked up that women feel like they have to alter their bodies and do dangerous things to them to make them beautiful, that's sort of fcked in the head if you think about it."
    What's fucked up is that women are so obsessed with ripping down other women who choose to exercise their right to self-expression, be it via plastic surgery, sexy clothing, makeup/hairstyles, et al.

    Envy is a right bitch.
    Idealism is fine, but as it approaches reality, the costs become prohibitive.

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  19. #19
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    I say let a man or a woman to what they want to their body, if it makes them feel better bout themselves then so be it. Peeps be judgin like whoa in this day and age.

  20. #20
    God/dess Mastridonicus's Avatar
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    As long as I continue to do things people don't understand. People will always blame my perceived misfortunes on my perceived stupidity.
    People are not ruled by their memories.

  21. #21
    God/dess Lexi's Avatar
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    I love my BA. Some of my customers wish I was "still natural" but ya know what? I LOVE them and no one was going to stop me from getting them.

    Some people are just so stupid.

  22. #22
    God/dess jaizaine's Avatar
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    Default Re: This irks the shit out of me

    The increased risk of suicide is a correlation not a causation. The women who committed suicide could have suffered from depression, body dysmorphic disorders and extreme self loathing. It does mention that in the article.
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