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Thread: She a boy now

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    God/dess ExoticEngineer's Avatar
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    Default She a boy now

    When my kiddo went to kindergarten there was a girl in his class, Brianna* and she would chase the boys, pick on the boys, beat on the boys if they got caught, typical girl/boy play. She was certainly a tomboy, always wore shorts, had shorter hair and very rough and tumble.

    She was held back after kindergarten, because of some disciplinary problems, and my kiddo moved on to first grade...I saw her a few times that year, she had even shorter hair, and wore boy clothes.

    Well this year they play on the same playground again, and when I went to go drop off my kiddo this week A kid ran up to him and slapped his back pack out of his hands and took off! So I asked my kid "who was that?"
    "Brian*."
    "Oh...looks like Brianna's brother."
    "No, he used to be Brianna, but it's Brian now."



    Confused, I went to go talk with a teach who is a close friend of mine, and before you all say she shouldn't have told me this...I know she shouldn't have...but she did;

    The mom changed Brianna's* sex in the paperwork for her class, changed the name to Brian* and cut her hair like a boys, and dressed her in boy clothes.

    K, so this upsets me a wee bit. I understand that maybe Brianna really does feel more comfortable this way...for now. But what about down the road? Highschool, shoot even middle school, kids are cruel and can be viscious. While I am not one to say anyone should pretend to be something they are not, I would worry about my childs safety at this point! And doesn't chasing boys and teasing them and picking on them say something about her mind set....hmmm...

    Or maybe I'm looking at it wrong. Anyway, what do you all think?




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    Veteran Member ChloeTheRed's Avatar
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    This kid may potentially been born as intersex and had his gender assigned as girl (his penis/clit was small, perhaps). As Brianna/Brian got older, it became clear that he really didn't self-identify or even act as a girl and the initial assignment was not the best.

    Seriously, if a child is born with abnormal genitals, they used* to perform gender assignment surgery immediately (despite the hugely increased anesthesia risks with neonates) and the gender to be assigned was based largely on the size of the phalloclit. Also, lots of kids were assigned as girls mostly because vaginoplasty is hugely less complicated than phalloplasty. Hell, there was one set of twins where one of the boys got part of his penis cut off during a botched circumcision (I think this was in the 60s or 70s) and they did surgery on his genitals to reassign him as a girl. Apparently preemptive genital mutilation was supposed to be less traumatic than having a small dick. He eventually got a sex-change to go back to being a boy, which matched how he had always felt.

    Edit: And by "used to" I mean that this was the normal course of action for pretty much all hospitals well into the 90s and is still the standard operating practice today in many. At least most of them bring in geneticists and pediatric endocrinologists to figure out the assignment instead of just measuring the sticky-out part of the genitals like they used to.

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    God/dess ExoticEngineer's Avatar
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    I had thought about that as well....but her/his behavour, to me anyway, says that she does not identify with being a boy. Not that she's girly, but the chasing the boys, teasing them, picking on them, it's all such girl behavour, isn't it?

    I mean, I acted this way when I was young, and so did most of my friends, who were all very tom-boyish like me.

    It's truly none of my business, but it makes me curious, and since i can't gossip with any of the moms (I would hate for it to get around to the kids or something) I come here to speculate.




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    Default Re: She a boy now

    Brian's/Brianna's mother or whoever the hell is in charge of the kid should get a psychological evaluation, because even if Brianna feels more comfortable as Brian, she's still a child and shouldn't get the re-enforcement. I understand that each individual has to develop by themself, but as a parent you still guide your child (or are suppose to) to abide the rules of society, common sense and cultural morals. If that kid is old enough and decides to experiment, or change things, then so be it, but up until then the legal guardian has to step in... that's what parents are for. It is a double-edged sword though to decide when enough is enough, because there's to much government interference going on already, while people try to raise or discipline their kids IMO.

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    Featured Member kikiwiki's Avatar
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    I was picked on during elementary school. I was a tomboy. I was taunted up until 6th grade, constantly being called a lesbian because I didn't like boys. It was traumatizing. And even worse, my mom would yell at me saying I better not like girls, among other things. I carry these memories with me. I wish I was able to be more myself in those days. I wish people around me supported me, encouraged me, that it was ok to get dirt under my fingernails, that I didn't have to wear a skirt, and cross my legs.
    Puberty hit. I tried hard to fit in. I began to like boys, most were feminine/geeky like. I still liked girls but never acted or admitted to it until after I left my home at 18. I now feel comfortable with myself. I live a much happier life. My family and my childhood friends doesn't know I'm bi but I'm not hiding my behavior that would hint to it anyway. My family has hinted to me that they may know but it's unspoken.
    Now, if my mom accepted me when I was young that I may have wanted to be a boy, or just allowed me to act out like a boy, I would probably be a stronger person today. My mom is more important than friends at school. That's all the support I need. Kids can be vicious, but being accepted by an adult, cancels out all the taunts those kids will give. I would have been a confident child if I had the support of my family. People/kids would see that and eventually gain respect for me.
    I saw the movie "mask" again last night. It's about a kid with a facial deformity that lived life to its fullest despite how others looked at him. He was taunted but gained acceptance from most because despite his deformity, he was a confident, likable, smart person. His mother contributed to shaping his attitude. His friends encouraged him even more. He died young but he lived happier than most teenagers with ordinary lives today.
    I'm glad that the mom of "brianna" saw to change her childs lifestyle to what she felt would be more comfortable for her. I'm glad this is happening in front of children at such a young age. This will teach acceptance and tolerance at such a young age. Your son will now grow up and take from this experience that we should not judge someone because of the life that they choose.
    "Where there is love there is life"-Mahatma Gandhi

    "Be The Best, F!ck The Rest"- P.P.


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    Default Re: She a boy now

    But there's a difference in either trying to raise a child or forcing them into becoming something they don't want to be. We all encountered moments where we hated our parents, but looking back not everything they tried was wrong. Of course, there are the ones that were vicious or cruel, because things didn't work out for them as they imagined, and those parents are the ones who leave their kids scarred for life...

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    Veteran Member ChloeTheRed's Avatar
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    Also, for the child's name to be legally changed, there would have had to be a court hearing. That means that the legal system has already vetted the sanity of those involved and whether or not the child really wanted this (probably by talking to the child without the parents)> My instinct is to say, "Butt out!"

  8. #8
    madmaxine
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    My brother was in a special education class & I came in one day to take him to a doctor's appointment...I said, "Hey, who's that pretty girl at the middle desk who has a frown on her face?" I didn't recognize her.

    He said, "That's Catalina." He then explained "she" was a he and he was in special ed to prevent his being messed with by other kids. (Catalina was otherwise fine & well-adjusted, I'm not sure why she was frowning that day!)

    This was in Northern California, where people are fairly unfazed by such things...

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    Default Re: She a boy now

    i think that she should be raised as a girl until atleast she goes threw puberty and can decide for herself . But i can understand why these parents may think they are doing the right thing transgender has been all over the tv the probaly saw a 20/20 special and thought thats what they should do.

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    Veteran Member CupCake's Avatar
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    I personally think changing the childs name and gender is wrong. It's hard for me to explain but mentally I just don't think a child that age should be able to make a choice like that. Once shes arounf 12-13 would be a good age to decied how she feels. I mean when I was her age I chased boys around, I was a little rougher then some girls I grew up with, heck I even beat up the boys!

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    God/dess Lena's Avatar
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    I'm sure they had their reasons and thought it out, it's not the kind of thing where you just wake up one day and decide your kids really a boy.



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    Default Re: She a boy now

    ^Yeah. There are quite a few genetic disorders that can provide for ambiguous gender and warrant a "reassessment" by kindergarten. If they continue to flip-flop the kid between boy and girl, yeah, that's not right. But as long as they stick with it, it might prove to be better now than later.



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  13. #13
    Tart
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    ^ I agree. C'mon now people. I happen to agree with the poster that said it's very possible that she is intersexed.

    And they possibly decided to change it now, while the child was young rather than having to do it in middle school or high school when everyone will know or remember.

    to change a childs name is NOT simple. You have to carry around a paper, you have to put a legal notice in the paper for 7 days and then a judge decides.

    Changing a gender...3x's as hard. it's not like you can walk in and say " she feels like a boy ..please change this ..thank you "

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    Featured Member kandie_kitten's Avatar
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    It's not as simple as"she chased boys so they decided to change her to 'Brian'"

    You have no idea what was happening at home. If on the off chance she did have both genders, or ambiguous genitals, she was likely given hormones and all kinds of medications to present her as a girl.

    As someone else stated, for her to actually be represented as "Brian", she would have had to be evalauted by several court-appointed psychiatrists, child welfare specialists, etc. It probably got to the point where he felt confused and angry in his own body, hated the hormones (I know in one case where the hormones made the individual very ill) and just got sick of it.

    Basically, this is a case which is far bigger, and more personal, than you can know, and it's better to just stay out of it.

  15. #15
    BrunetteGoddess
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    I really think the girl sounds too young to be told that she identifies better with the other sex, therefore she should become it. Like EE said; she's acting like a girl for crissakes; a lot of little girls are tomboys. Doesn't mean they want to be reassigned boys! It's just too young to decide. It's a big decision as an adult, and it's even bigger, maybe too big, to make as a child.

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    God/dess Lysondra's Avatar
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    I'm sure they had their reasons for what they did and I'm sure their reasons were what they thought was best for the child. I'm fairly certain they just can't change documents because they 'want to' and they actually need legal help which would've cost them a lot of money.

    I'm actually PROUD of the parents for taking action so quickly and being so supportive of their child's issues so early in life. At least they're not being judgemental and cruel and telling the child to 'deal with it' or 'wait til you're older' when a perhaps more real gender is showing itself.

    Whatever their reasons are, whatever their motives - it's not your problem anyway. A sex change isn't going to harm your child and your son even seemed perfectly okay with it, like it wasn't a big deal... and that's nice to see.


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    Default Re: She a boy now

    EE *IS* staying out of it. She's just curious, which is natural. I'm personally fascinated by this stuff. If I'd run across this situation I'd have posted about it. People need to talk about this sort of thing instead of making it all hush hush taboo.

    About 4% of live births in the U.S. are intersex. This could mean anything from complete hermaphroditism (having complete male and female systems) to simply having XXY chromosomes but otherwise being entirely male, inside and out. Or LOTS of things in between. It's far more common than people realize.

    I have to disagree that turning your female child into a male is supportive of his/her "tomboy" tendencies. I think it's the exact opposite. It's saying, "It is not appropriate for you to act this way if you're a girl so we're going to make you a boy." Then again, the parents likely thought it all out and are being incredibly progressive about the whole thing. Perhaps her sex was up in the air all along and they're just trying to choose the one that best fits. Too bad there are only two in Western culture.

    Either way, I don't think you'll ever know.

  18. #18
    BrunetteGoddess
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    After I read all of the posts in this thread I've decided I don't know enough about the child's situation to know if it was just her acting like a tomboy and chasing boys, or if there was other things going on. So therefore, I'm not sure what I think. I need more info.

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    God/dess ExoticEngineer's Avatar
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    Wow, okay, to some of the posters who may have misunderstood me...I AM staying out of it. It is not my situation, and like I said before, I wish we lived in a world where things such as this were not so "taboo". Goodness.

    So everyone take a deep breath now.....

    I was jsut very curious as to how others saw this situation. As far as her cahsing boys....to me that demonstrates a femininde personality. Not a male one. Which is part of what confused me.

    As a parent....if my 7 year old son were to ask me to let him dress like a girl, grow his hair out and start calling him Alexis...well. I would have some serious reservations about it. Now, if it were a medical issue, like stated before, where he was born in a situation that required us to make a choice...wow, I'm not sure what I would do, maybe try to raise him as A sexual as possible until one gender or the other took root? (winging it here).

    I just thought that a 5 year old was a very young child to be experiencing this. Combined with the fact that there was obvious girl behavour, conficting with the physical appearance.

    So eh...didn't mean to ruffle feathers here, I was jsut very curious about it all.




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    God/dess ExoticEngineer's Avatar
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    Oh holy typos...I'd go back and fix them but I would be here all day.




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    God/dess ExoticEngineer's Avatar
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    Wow Paris, thank you for posting that link. I want to go back and watch parts 4 and 5...have to get ready for work though.

    Very enlightening




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    God/dess Paris's Avatar
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    I saw that program when it aired. I thought that the parents were being very loving to their kids, and it warmed my heart to see parents to accept their children's desire to be another gender. Anything less would be just mean.

    I've thought that gender went beyond what is between the legs. I knew a couple that the (biological) wife was lesbian. Her (biologically male) husband was and is attracted to women but also enjoyed the feminine things in life, too. He decided to have a sex change and now they are still happily married. he had a sex change operation so that he could become a lesbian.

    Odd, I know, but they are both a lot happier now. They had two children together before he had the change. They are probably the only lesbian couple that have biological children together.


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  24. #24
    cameron_keys
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    Brian may grow up to be a gay male. But he will still identify with being male and not female. Hence the chasing boys and feminine behavior you saw.
    Or he may just be acting like a child. Kids at that age of both sexes can act similar..chasing and teasing, etc...because hormones have not really come into play yet.

    Either way..they would have had to go through hoops to get this done and then some..so they,along with many Dr's and courts saw this as appropriate.So there must have been a good reason.

  25. #25
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    Default Re: She a boy now

    Someone please tell my mother I *did* learn something in school.

    Gender dysphoria
    http://goliath.ecnext.com/coms2/gi_0...er-change.html



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